I'm currently working on improving the live control while playing the keyboard and have come across a problem. I would like to trigger the strobe effect with a footswitch. As it is not possible to control the Flash FX buttons directly, I have found another solution.
The switch sends a DMX signal, which I assign directly to the strobe channel via WLINK/DMX IN.
My washers have a strobe channel that is off from 0-15 and triggers strobe in increasing tempo from 16-255. The footswitch works here without any problems. When triggered it sends a strobe value and when released it has been programmed to send the value 0 again to reset the strobe effect. I can control the channel without using FORCE.
Unfortunately, this does not work with my spots.
On the spots, the strobe channel is connected to a shutter and is set up as follows. From 0-5 the shutter is closed, from 6-250 it is strobe and from 251-255 the shutter is open.
This means that the shutter constantly receives a 251 signal during operation when the spotlight is switched on to ensure that it is open, otherwise the spotlight remains dark. As DMX IN has a very low priority, the incoming signal is always overwritten and I have to use the FORCE function so that the signal is recognised. Then the footswitch works and sends a strobe value when pressed and 251 when released, so that the shutter remains open and the spotlight stays on and works in the current preset.
However, in FORCE mode I can no longer access the channel with the Wolfmix itself. I know that my foot pedal only sends the DMX value once. This means that it sends the value 251 for strobe off and shutter open, the Wolfmix holds it automatically if no other signal overwrites it.
However, this means that the spot is now always on. I can no longer access it via Flash FX Strobe and can no longer switch the spot off, as this value from DMX IN FORCE always remains. I can no longer change the channel with any of Wolfmix's own functions.
Even if the FORCE function has a very high priority, shouldn't the value actually be overwritten by the internal functions if there is no more signal at the input?
How can I solve this problem?
How can I control the shutter via Wolfmix and trigger the strobe via foot pedal at the same time?
Many thanks for your feedback.
External Control DMX IN FORCE
Re: External Control DMX IN FORCE
Hello,
Thanks for raising this post! I am going to presume that your spots fixture has either a Dimmer or RGB channels also- which can be used in the place of a Shutter channel if no Shutter channel is detected. So with that being said, there are a couple of options for you. You can either:
- Remove the Shutter channel assignment from each of your spots by:
---- Going to Settings > DMX Values > Settings (Beam Editor)
---- Find your spot fixture
---- Scroll to the Shutter feature and press in the encoder
---- Change the channel number to ' - '
---- Repeat this for the other spots
Or
- Edit the profile itself so that the 'Shutter Open' becomes a 'Strobe Off' preset, and the 'Shutter Closed' becomes a 'No Function' or any other preset type that is not associated with a Shutter channel.
We can either do this on your behalf, or you can do this yourself through the in-built fixture editor, or our online profile builder website at profile.nicolaudiegroup.com.
Hopefully this helps, but please do let us know if you have any further questions or issues at all!
Kind regards,
Will
Thanks for raising this post! I am going to presume that your spots fixture has either a Dimmer or RGB channels also- which can be used in the place of a Shutter channel if no Shutter channel is detected. So with that being said, there are a couple of options for you. You can either:
- Remove the Shutter channel assignment from each of your spots by:
---- Going to Settings > DMX Values > Settings (Beam Editor)
---- Find your spot fixture
---- Scroll to the Shutter feature and press in the encoder
---- Change the channel number to ' - '
---- Repeat this for the other spots
Or
- Edit the profile itself so that the 'Shutter Open' becomes a 'Strobe Off' preset, and the 'Shutter Closed' becomes a 'No Function' or any other preset type that is not associated with a Shutter channel.
We can either do this on your behalf, or you can do this yourself through the in-built fixture editor, or our online profile builder website at profile.nicolaudiegroup.com.
Hopefully this helps, but please do let us know if you have any further questions or issues at all!
Kind regards,
Will
Re: External Control DMX IN FORCE
This solution worked great and has since been used successfully on stage a few times. Many thanks again for the quick and really competent help.
However, I am now facing the next problem, which again concerns the same issue. I hope that there is a solution for this as well.
A brief description of the situation: In addition to the moving lights mentioned above, our band has bought a couple of blinders with RGB LEDs (see appendix for channel assignment). We would now like to integrate these into our existing lighting setup. During normal operation, when a preset is running, they should run as background lighting by simply being integrated into the Colour FX and the Beam FX. As these are blinders, which are logically very bright, they are dimmed to around 30% using the group dimmer on the home page.
The important thing now is to use them as effect highlights, which is what they are actually intended for. I would like to have the following 2 functions. Firstly, I would like them to blind at the press of a button in a nice warm white colour (100% red, 80% green, 10% blue, 100% dimmer). Secondly, I would like to have a strobe function, also in the colour warm white and on 100% dimmer (like blind, but also triggering the strobe channel).
This basically works exactly as planned via the Live Edits application. There I can set the corresponding DMX values for both desired effects and set the Live Edit to Flash. The effects can then be triggered at the press of a button and when they are released, the lights return to their normal dimmed mode with Colour and Beam FX.
My problem now is that I am the keyboard player in the band and control the lights at the same time, which is why I would like to trigger the two effects described above using a foot pedal. I have a home-made and in principle freely programmable foot pedal that can send any MIDI and DMX command both when pressed and when released. However, I have not found a solution for controlling the new lights with it.
Live Edits cannot be controlled externally.
If I want to control the channels directly via DMX-IN without Force, I cannot access them as they are already controlled by colour/beam FX with higher priority.
If I set DMX-IN to Force, I can control the channels externally, but they are then always overwritten. When I release the pedal, when there is actually no more signal coming in via DMX-IN, Color/Beam-FX does not take over again.
The simplest thing would be to be able to trigger live edits externally, but that doesn't seem to be included in the new update either, from what I've already read.
So how can I solve this problem? So far, the Wolfmix is just perfect for exactly what we need as a live band, so it would be great if there was a solution here too.
However, I am now facing the next problem, which again concerns the same issue. I hope that there is a solution for this as well.
A brief description of the situation: In addition to the moving lights mentioned above, our band has bought a couple of blinders with RGB LEDs (see appendix for channel assignment). We would now like to integrate these into our existing lighting setup. During normal operation, when a preset is running, they should run as background lighting by simply being integrated into the Colour FX and the Beam FX. As these are blinders, which are logically very bright, they are dimmed to around 30% using the group dimmer on the home page.
The important thing now is to use them as effect highlights, which is what they are actually intended for. I would like to have the following 2 functions. Firstly, I would like them to blind at the press of a button in a nice warm white colour (100% red, 80% green, 10% blue, 100% dimmer). Secondly, I would like to have a strobe function, also in the colour warm white and on 100% dimmer (like blind, but also triggering the strobe channel).
This basically works exactly as planned via the Live Edits application. There I can set the corresponding DMX values for both desired effects and set the Live Edit to Flash. The effects can then be triggered at the press of a button and when they are released, the lights return to their normal dimmed mode with Colour and Beam FX.
My problem now is that I am the keyboard player in the band and control the lights at the same time, which is why I would like to trigger the two effects described above using a foot pedal. I have a home-made and in principle freely programmable foot pedal that can send any MIDI and DMX command both when pressed and when released. However, I have not found a solution for controlling the new lights with it.
Live Edits cannot be controlled externally.
If I want to control the channels directly via DMX-IN without Force, I cannot access them as they are already controlled by colour/beam FX with higher priority.
If I set DMX-IN to Force, I can control the channels externally, but they are then always overwritten. When I release the pedal, when there is actually no more signal coming in via DMX-IN, Color/Beam-FX does not take over again.
The simplest thing would be to be able to trigger live edits externally, but that doesn't seem to be included in the new update either, from what I've already read.
So how can I solve this problem? So far, the Wolfmix is just perfect for exactly what we need as a live band, so it would be great if there was a solution here too.
- Attachments
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- BlinderChannels.jpg (45.64 KiB) Viewed 2538 times
Re: External Control DMX IN FORCE
I've tried a lot of things over the past few weeks, but still haven't found a solution to the problem. Specifically, the DMX IN assignment to individual channels keeps failing. I now have a question about this.
As can be seen from the priority hierarchy, DMX IN has a very low priority. As soon as the light is integrated into one of the FX engines, as in my case, it is already overwritten. DMX IN FORCE, on the other hand, has a very high priority and overwrites almost everything, which is why I have to use it in this way.
My understanding would now be that as long as no signal of higher priority is active, a signal from a lower level 'passes through'. This is also the case with e.g. Default, FX Engines, Flash FX, Live Edits and so on. Only DMX IN FORCE behaves differently and, in my opinion, senselessly. As soon as the input signal is set to FORCE, it ‘blocks’ all underlying DMX signals and no longer allows any control through, even if there is not even a signal at DMX IN. The best example of this is when I assign any channel to a DMX-IN and switch it to FORCE, the value automatically jumps to 0, even if DMX-IN is not even plugged in, i.e. not even a signal can be present. It now only reacts to a potential input signal; if none arrives, it no longer allows commands from a lower priority to pass through, but remains fixed at the last received value or 0.
This is a big problem for me and, according to my logic, not correct. How can this behaviour be explained? Is this correct or will it be changed (perhaps in the new firmware)?
As can be seen from the priority hierarchy, DMX IN has a very low priority. As soon as the light is integrated into one of the FX engines, as in my case, it is already overwritten. DMX IN FORCE, on the other hand, has a very high priority and overwrites almost everything, which is why I have to use it in this way.
My understanding would now be that as long as no signal of higher priority is active, a signal from a lower level 'passes through'. This is also the case with e.g. Default, FX Engines, Flash FX, Live Edits and so on. Only DMX IN FORCE behaves differently and, in my opinion, senselessly. As soon as the input signal is set to FORCE, it ‘blocks’ all underlying DMX signals and no longer allows any control through, even if there is not even a signal at DMX IN. The best example of this is when I assign any channel to a DMX-IN and switch it to FORCE, the value automatically jumps to 0, even if DMX-IN is not even plugged in, i.e. not even a signal can be present. It now only reacts to a potential input signal; if none arrives, it no longer allows commands from a lower priority to pass through, but remains fixed at the last received value or 0.
This is a big problem for me and, according to my logic, not correct. How can this behaviour be explained? Is this correct or will it be changed (perhaps in the new firmware)?
Re: External Control DMX IN FORCE
Hello Manu,
I actually believe there might be a solution here in the new Firmware 2.0- please allow me to explain.
When saving Presets in the new FW, you will be able to store certain components (specifically Colour, Position and Beam). However- you can also choose not to store any of these at all. This means you can create a new Preset which essentially does not store the Colour FX, Colour, Move FX, Position, or Beam FX settings at all... But it will store any active Live Edits. This means you can set the Preset to store the Live Edit, then map the Preset to DMX input so that when the required value is received- the Preset will trigger (activating the Live Edit, but leaving alone all other features).
Hopefully this will be something that will help, I will look forward to hearing what you think when the update is available
Kind regards,
Will
I actually believe there might be a solution here in the new Firmware 2.0- please allow me to explain.
When saving Presets in the new FW, you will be able to store certain components (specifically Colour, Position and Beam). However- you can also choose not to store any of these at all. This means you can create a new Preset which essentially does not store the Colour FX, Colour, Move FX, Position, or Beam FX settings at all... But it will store any active Live Edits. This means you can set the Preset to store the Live Edit, then map the Preset to DMX input so that when the required value is received- the Preset will trigger (activating the Live Edit, but leaving alone all other features).
Hopefully this will be something that will help, I will look forward to hearing what you think when the update is available
Kind regards,
Will
Re: External Control DMX IN FORCE
Hello Will,
Thank you very much for your reply, that's great news.
In the end, this is exactly the function I need and would solve my problem. It is an external triggering of live edits only via detours, but I can live with that.
The statement indicates what I have already read, namely that several presets can be active at the same time in the new firmware and can be layered on top of each other. Now I'm wondering how the presets will be triggered via DMX IN? Previously, the triggering of one preset always replaced the other, as only one could be active at a time. This is no longer necessarily the case, so how is the selection of presets solved in FW 2.0?
In the announcement I also read about a MIDI assignment to the Flash FX functions. Will it also be possible to control these via DMX-IN? I have an MK1 and so far have used DMX-IN for all external control, which has worked great so far. Now I'm wondering if this will also be the case for Flash-FX, or if this will only work via MIDI (as written in the announcement)?
Sorry to be so curious, but I can hardly wait until the new firmware is released. I'm already eagerly awaiting it and will of course report back as soon as I've tested the new functions. However, I would be happy to receive some information in advance.
Thank you very much for your reply, that's great news.
In the end, this is exactly the function I need and would solve my problem. It is an external triggering of live edits only via detours, but I can live with that.The statement indicates what I have already read, namely that several presets can be active at the same time in the new firmware and can be layered on top of each other. Now I'm wondering how the presets will be triggered via DMX IN? Previously, the triggering of one preset always replaced the other, as only one could be active at a time. This is no longer necessarily the case, so how is the selection of presets solved in FW 2.0?
In the announcement I also read about a MIDI assignment to the Flash FX functions. Will it also be possible to control these via DMX-IN? I have an MK1 and so far have used DMX-IN for all external control, which has worked great so far. Now I'm wondering if this will also be the case for Flash-FX, or if this will only work via MIDI (as written in the announcement)?
Sorry to be so curious, but I can hardly wait until the new firmware is released. I'm already eagerly awaiting it and will of course report back as soon as I've tested the new functions. However, I would be happy to receive some information in advance.
Re: External Control DMX IN FORCE
Hi Manu,
The new update will essentially bring a different approach to how Presets are treated. It is of course possible to use them how they currently are, but with the possibility to include/exclude certain features, you can now think of Presets more like specific command triggers, than wholistic 'scenes'. So it's not the fact that multiple Presets are playing at once, it's more that Presets can be set to only recall specific functions, whilst leaving others running as before... Hopefully that makes sense, but it should make sense once you have it in front of you!
I'm actually not 100% sure about the DMX input for Flash FX, I haven't seen/tested that function yet- so I wouldn't like to say either way! Hopefully will have more info on that very soon.
Kind regards,
Will
The new update will essentially bring a different approach to how Presets are treated. It is of course possible to use them how they currently are, but with the possibility to include/exclude certain features, you can now think of Presets more like specific command triggers, than wholistic 'scenes'. So it's not the fact that multiple Presets are playing at once, it's more that Presets can be set to only recall specific functions, whilst leaving others running as before... Hopefully that makes sense, but it should make sense once you have it in front of you!
I'm actually not 100% sure about the DMX input for Flash FX, I haven't seen/tested that function yet- so I wouldn't like to say either way! Hopefully will have more info on that very soon.
Kind regards,
Will